Nothing to see here. Move along. Move along.
Ocean temperatures rise again
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Ask yourself a question.
How would they know?
Prior to the deployment of the Argo floats, there was no accurate way to measure ocean heat below the top 50 feet. So, what we have now are different kinds of proxies and actual measurements tacked on together.
In any case, ocean heat uptake is more dependent on cloud cover than air temperature.
This issue has come up repeatedly, it is usually raised when air temperature data contradicts the narrative. There has been no increase in global average air temperature for the last 8 years. So, now we change the subject to ocean temps.
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“So, now we change the subject to ocean temps.”
I don’t think anyone is changing the subject. I simply reported a new data point. But, I am pretty sure that the ocean is far more important as a store for excess heat than the atmosphere.
How would they know?
I guess it depends on what you mean by “know.” But it seems that reputable scientists believe they have got reasonably accurate indication of the changes going on. Or are they “corrupt?”
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Corrupt or not, the data to support the claim does not exist.
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“Corrupt or not, the data to support the claim does not exist.”
That is 100% pure bullshit.
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Really?
From what source would they have worldwide temperature and salinity data for depths from the surface to 2000 meters?
Modeling from proxies is not data,
The Argos buoys are providing that kind of data now, but they have not been deployed in sufficient numbers long enough to support those claims. (Argos buoys sink to 4000 to 6000 meters and ‘sleep’ then periodically rise to the surface, recording temperature and salinity as they rise, transmit the data and sink and sleep again)
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Really.
Whatever the imperfections of the data, the same methodologies applied year after year show the heat contained in the ocean to be increasing. The fact that you can imagine better data or better methodology is not a rational reason to dismiss the findings reported.
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RE: “That is 100% pure bullshit.”
How so? Why should anyone believe you?
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And note that serial climate fraudster Maichael Mann is involved in this claim, so I will presume fraud until proven otherwise.
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I did notice Michael Mann. That almost makes me want to believe in conspiracy theories.
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Reputable scientists work with data. The report is the work of reputable scientists. Is it possible to imagine better data from better sources? Sure.
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“And note that serial climate fraudster . . .”
Leaving aside the nonsense of that slander, it is worth noting that it is coming from someone frequently on a high horse about argumentum ad hominem when scurrilous web sites are challenged as unreliable sources.
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RE: “How would they know?”
Good question. According to Mr. Murphy’s source, the ocean temperature records on which the alarm is based are younger than I am. So while the oceans may be hotter today than the day I was born, the timespan of the observation is insignificant.
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The database is much shorter than that.
An adequate number of Argos buoys has only been deployed for less than a decade.
Prior to that, there were questionable surface temp readings from coolant water intakes on ships, but nothing about temperatures down to the thermocline. which rises and falls due to ENSO and AMO.
The data to support the claim just doesn’t exist.
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RE: “An adequate number of Argos buoys has only been deployed for less than a decade.”
Yes, I looked into the Argos buoys and found this NOAA web site:
https://www.aoml.noaa.gov/argo/
The oceans are four billion years old. A decade or two of temperature observations that we don’t understand don’t amount to a valid cause for panic.
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For what it is worth, some info on ocean temperature measurement.
https://skepticalscience.com/ocean_temperature_part1.html
And the ongoing research on ancient sea water temperatures and its limitations.
https://www.ocean.washington.edu/story/Ancient_Ocean_Temperatures
I try to stay clear of climate issues. I’m not a scientist. Still, we are witnessing seemingly rare events becoming less rare in recent years. Maybe that is the norm, but we have 7+ billion people today, most living in vulnerable areas. Debate should continue if for no other reason than to save lives and prevent wars.
Politicizing science from all sides is like debating gravity while trying to talk down a jumper. It might seem interesting, but doesn’t solve the problem of survival.
IMO
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