It appears there may have been only one homicide at the capitol

CNN backtracks on officer cause of death

Breaking into the capitol is still a crime but felony murder charges are pretty much off the table.

40 thoughts on “It appears there may have been only one homicide at the capitol

  1. Breaking into the Capitol and trespassing are the only types of charges available as there are no “domestic terrorism” laws under which the insurrectionists can be charged.

    McVeigh got charged with a bunch of murders because there are no laws against domestic terrorism.

    I do not believe we need a Patriot Act 2.0. But I do believe that some sort of domestic terrorism charges should be available to prosecutors. The Pittsburgh synagogue shooter should also have had those types of charges filed, as should others. Until they are available, there is nothing prosecutors can do but charge citizens who perform terrorist acts with other crimes that already are codified.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. How will you define domestic terrorism?

      I would define it as the use of violence to obtain a political end.

      But if you go there, we’re going to need that prison space legalizing marijuana will open up to hold BLM and Antifa rioters just as much as those who entered the capitol building unlawfully.


        1. What, was defund the police not a political cause?

          There are lots of problems with the Patriot Act. What definition are you referring to specifically? We need a common language to disusss it.


          1. I said “template” with the idea being to learn from mistakes and unintended consequences and create something workable. Kinda like the Congress was supposed to do with the ACA.

            “Defund” was a misnomer of pushing for police “reform” , and no it was not. In fact it was repudiated by President Biden mmediately.

            Liked by 1 person

      1. Violence is violence. I have no problem prosecuting the actual looters, arsonists and rioters no matter who they are.

        My guess is that if the prosecute some of those arrested for violence this last summer they will find more than a few supremacists and MAGA gang members in the docket. Unfortunately like the Rittenhouse case, police ignored or even thanked perpetrators if they were White.

        Over the recent years we investigated and talked about radicalized Islamic terrorists. It is about time that we pay attention to these homegrown gangs that crawled out from under rocks when the clouds of tacit acceptance moved in with this last administration.

        “My rough guys” and “stand by” was the green light for mayhem. Watching hundreds of armed gang members in helmets, tactical gear and climbing ropes pretty much sums up what the last president thought about our Constitution.

        Can we not charge him with domestic terrorism? Much like the Mafia chieftains who were prosecuted for ordering hits, but not actually pulling triggers.

        Nah, not when the nation’s minority party welcomes Congressional representatives who believe the Democrats drink babies’ blood or that school shootings were executed by the Screen Actors Guild.

        Liked by 3 people

          1. Uh, no he is not, in his mind. His gangs are still active and ready to attack.

            McCarthy and Greene kissing the ring by hopping right over to Mar a Lago.

            Hard to ignore the obvious.

            The issue is murder and terrorism in an attack on the Capitol. Would that even have happened without Trump?

            The elephant in the room wears a long, red tie.

            Liked by 2 people

          2. “Trump is out of office”…

            Once you convince the people who are saying that “Trump is my President” even after January 20th, then I’ll accept that he is truly “out of office”.

            And THAT, my good Dentist, is the relevancy of T****, even 3 weeks post-inaugural.

            Liked by 1 person

        1. “thanked perpetrators if they were white” shit. Was this written by Schiff or are you taking lessons from him in writing bullshit parodies? In addition, this systemic racism false narrative is really past it’s usefulness. Yawn…


      2. I agree.

        And those responsible for the violence that overtook the actual meaning of the social justice protests this past summer would fall under that mantle.

        However, how do you explain what happened in Lafayette Square for the photo-oop from hell? Those were peaceful protesters, not armed with mace, pepper spray or any other weapon of violence and they were ATTACKED by National Guard and police forces, under order of SOMEONE in the WH. Not one individual came to that location planning violence, nor was it driven by some demi-god who just could not accept the fact that more Americans wanted him out of office then wanted him to remain.

        And keep in mind the FBI has determined that MANY of those responsible for the violence this summer were right wing infiltrators sent to disrupt the peaceful protests. Lots of Proud Boys, Oath Keepers and 3 percenters alongside the fictional “ANTIFA” rioters.

        So yes, Charge those responsible for violence as they should be. But don’t say that the folks who stormed the Capitol on January 6th were mere “trespassers”. Once you change your tune on that, maybe you’ll have legitimate creedence to say what you say.


        1. It has become clear that SOME of those who entered the capitol were there on an organized mission of ill intent. Their actions were preplanned days to weeks prior to the rally.

          But it remains that easily 90% of those who entered were simply trespassers carried away by the events of the day.


          1. “…90% of those who entered were simply trespassers carried away by the events of the day.”

            Gee, how come the protesters didn’t get that pass in the summer demonstrations. Trespassers that got carried away. They were shot at with rubber bullets, gassed, beaten and arrested.

            Most did not burn, loot or vandalize.

            Double standard…expected, but still wrong.

            Liked by 1 person

      1. Justifiable homicide debatable? If an intruder leading a gang of rabid thugs into your home came through the broken door would you offer cookies and tea?

        It looked to me as if Babbitt was shoved to the front by the gang members perhaps hoping that the security teams would not shoot a woman. But that is just speculation.

        There is a question of culpability among the gang members, however. If you are part of a gang committing a crime and someone dies, you don’t have to be the triggerman to get charged with homicide.

        Watching Capitol police being dragged down steps and beaten, jabbed, tased and kicked seems to be overlooked by Republicans. That more of the few dozen or so cops that were hospitalized didn’t die is a miracle.

        Liked by 2 people

      2. “The Wall Street Journal first reported that police investigators have recommended the officer not be charged“

        You should look up the definition of “homicide”..

        Liked by 1 person

        1. Homicide is the killing of one person by another. It can be criminal, negligent, excusable or justifiable.

          Why, was Ms Babbit killed by something other than another person?

          That police investigators did not recommend charges tells us nothing.


  2. Most of the comments in this thread relate to the assumption that the mob was criminal. Not seen is the fake news that CNN promoted.


    1. The mob was criminal. Cops were attacked enthusiastically and brutally. Doors smashed and office vandalized.

      Perhaps the fire extinguisher did not result in death, but it was a miracle that others beaten and dragged did not die.

      What apologists are insisting is that because there is some question as to the direct cause of the officer’s death, blunt force, bear spray, etc., then the whole insurrection was just a picnic that got a bit rowdy.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. The puzzle for you lies in sorting out how much of your conception of the events of Jan. 6 is wrongly inspired by the false information you have absorbed.


          1. I don’t think I said that. The article implied deceit, but the officer died shortly after the insurrection and the cause is now being reviewed.

            If you ever bother to see some of the video footage, it is a miracle more police were not killed because the gang members sure tried hard to do just that.

            The indictments are just multiplying and whether this officer died from a fire extinguisher on his head or other injuries sustained at the hands of attackers is important, but kind of moot.

            Thousands surrounded the Capitol, hundreds broached security. And most of those came armed, armored, well supplied with communication gear, climbing gear with the sole purpose of physically forcing Congress and the VP to illegally overturn the will of 80+ million American citizens.

            If the tasers they were armed with were made by Acme instead of the reported Zap, Inc. is just a distraction.

            Liked by 1 person

        1. Interesting comment when you consider that the nopb was motivated by false information flowing from the Oval Office, right wing news media, and the social media postings of many in attendance.

          Where is the proof of fraud? Mike Lindell’s “docufictionary”? Even OANN, who aired the fictional movie, had to provide a long winded disavowal of the statements made in Lindell’s screed. Otherwise, the defamation suits would have been roaring back.

          Your attempt at projection and deflection shows how enamored adn blindly loyal you are to the loser of the Election.

          Liked by 1 person

      2. It is interesting to see this thread in juxtaposition to the thread on George Floyd.

        Had MS Babitt been Black and protesting some liberal cause under exactly the same conditions, all we would be hearing about was the unarmed woman who was murdered by a policeman who was under no immediate threat from her.

        I will wait for the results of the inquiry before taking a position on the homicide, but it appears it makes a difference to some what cause is being protested.


        1. Had Babbitt been Black and part of assault by Black radicals they would have been killed long before broaching the Capitol.

          “Cause supported”? And what cause justified an assault on Congress by armed, armored and coordinated gangs?

          Liked by 2 people

          1. So, to you, the cause does matter, and not the specifics.

            Was she an eminent threat to the officer or anyone else to the extent that would justify using deadly force?

            Race should not matter, nor the reason she was coming through that window. Deadly force is justified to protect someone from death or serious injury, or to prevent the escape of a criminal who poses an immediate threat to the public. Either those criteria were met or they weren’t.

            Her poltics are irrelevant.


          2. “Race should not matter,”…

            Yet it always does. If the mob at the Capitol had been black and brown Americans, the steps of the building and the halls would have been flowing with the blood of those “trespassers”. To deny that is to deny truth.

            Not one cop knelt on one neck. Do deny the racial disparities of how these things are handled is to be blind to one’s own racism.

            Prove me wrong. You can’t, but I dare you to try.


          3. “That is a speculation unsupported by recent experience.”

            You really believe that, don’t you?

            A mob composed mostly of white Americans stormed the Capitol and only one shot was fired. Yet the protesters were armed with mace, pepper spray and poles and sticks capable of being used as deadly weapons. But peaceful, TRULY peaceful protesters, were attacked by Law Enforcement and National Guard troops in Lafayette Square with tear gas, pepper spray and rubber bullets. And they were protesting something legitimate: lack of social justice.

            By recent experience, if the mob on 1/6 were Black and Brown, the outcome would have looked completely different. I doubt they would have made it to the steps before the shots were fired.


          4. Shifting gears? She was bursting through the broken window. The security officers were the last defense against a mob of rabid gangsters.

            How well would they have fared had she paved the way for the armed thugs around and behind her?

            I mentioned race because BLM came up. And you know how tight security would have been if the rally had been Black.

            Liked by 1 person

          5. Grievance politics as expected.

            Many were armed with tasers, bear sprays, clubs, flags with points for spears, body armor. etc. Deadly weapons all if used to disable and disarm.

            Not to mention the numbers of rioters involved.

            We saw how they easily plowed through police, barricades, doors, windows, etc.

            For the same reason you give a green light to cop shootings, I would allow some concern for both the lives of the security personnel and their charges.

            “Just lay down your weapons and leave the building peacefully and no one would have been shot.” You think that would have been appropriate.

            You write like you have not seen any of the videos and the extreme violence perpetrated against the defenders of the Capitol.

            Liked by 1 person

          6. It’s kind of hard to overwhelm by force of numbers crawling through a window.

            As I said, I will wait for an investigation, and not by the same police dept involved.

            But justified or not, it was a homicide, and the only one that took place.


          7. You still haven’t seen the videos. It was a door that was being smashed open, when the glass broke, the crowd surged.

            Rittenhouse had a bag tossed at him and he killed 2 and maimed a third, then he casually walked away. That was fine with you. These security guys were facing an enraged mob, armed and surging. And their job was to protect the lives of those entrusted to them.

            What is curious is how that might have been the only shot fired. The restraint was amazing. No rubber bullets even.

            Liked by 1 person

      3. RE: “Please explain what I have gotten wrong. I am willing to learn.”

        You say, “The mob was criminal. Cops were attacked enthusiastically and brutally.” But this thread concerns an example of criminal behavior that did not, in fact, happen. How many other “crimes” related to the Jan. 6 events exist only in your imagination as a result of purveyors of news you presume to be reliable?

        The lesson to learn is to be skeptical, even of your own opinions.


        1. Sure, none of the assaults happened in the
          videos and selfie shots?

          In the melee there was a video that showed a tossed fire extinguisher bouncing off an officer.

          Already, the gaslighting by the right is evident. Meanwhile arrests are piling up and consideration of serious conspiracy charges are in rather works.

          So believe whatever you want, this assault was real, dangerous and would never have happened without direct influence by the ex-president. He scheduled the rally, encouraged “wild” and he and his surrogates demanded action, “fight”, “trial by combat”, “take back you country”…etc. ad nauseum.

          Yes, accuracy is paramount and if it turns out that the dead policeman was murdered by bear spray or other assaults that may have exacerbated a medical issue, he is still dead.

          Liked by 1 person

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